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The OGs Revealed - the Thread

GilDLax

Well-Known Member
She was made a Zero Squad member because of creating the uniform, this would've been thousands of years before the Gotei existed and before Yamamoto formed his school.
Why assume she joined immediately? Hikifune did when she was already a captain. Hence why I brought up the possibility that she invented it when she was no fighter or strong enough.


Doesn't make sense to assume she sat around doing nothing for thousands of years
Do you even read? Where did I say she did nothing? I said there are clearly other jobs in SS. Also the point is if she indeed invented the Shihakusho when she was not a fighter, then of course she would sat around, and not doing nothing but rather doing clothes as she was supposed to. That's also a job. There's the 9th seat of 6th Division who has a glass shop.



That you have to bend over backwards creating theories of the timeline tells you this much.
So if it's complicated, it must be wrong? What kind of logic is that? You're being lazy in thinking, not me ''bend over backwards''. Why not read something way simpler? You're reading Bleach. Written by a mangaka who outright said there were 4 levels of secrets in his work and that he himself hated being spoonfed. Same guy who pulled shit like 10th Espada is actually 0th Espada. Occam Razor is not an absolute rule, it's at best a preferrence. Kubo doesn't have to have the same preferrence as you do or even if he did, nothing stops him from doing otherwise in certain cases.

That we don't have a clear explanation and have to sit here trying to make sense of the timeline and reason (other than the lazy approach "oh it's just retcon'') tells you as much that you're supposed to think more about it.

None of my point is fanfic or even that convoluted. I presented only facts. There ARE other organizations in SS, there ARE NOble families who don't take jobs in Gotei 13 (or used to) and there WERE 1000-year gap between Shihakusho invention+Academy open and Gotei 13 establishment. So Shutara had to do something during those times anw.


All of this only if Shutara wasn't actually one of the 2 girls in the OG.
 

Deathbringerpt

Dreamer of Possibilities
Even if Shutara's invention is one of the oldest, it doesn't mean she was necessarily part of the Gotei 13 , nor did it mean she was strong enough to join the Royal Guard in the first place at the time.

It's not that hard to rationalize it.
 

MShadows

Deathbat
Moderator
Strength is not a criteria by which one joins the RG. Only those who have revolutionized SS are invited to join.

In theory, even Hanataro or Kurumadani could someday join the RG if by some divine chance they manage to invent an awe inspiring thing.

The insane power up comes after joining the RG.
 

Mar55

The Darkness Rises
Why assume she joined immediately?
The Zero Squad doesn't arbitrarily wait, they act immediately when necessary. Promotions would be no different, unless you had proof to the contrary.
Hikifune did when she was already a captain.
I'm not even sure what this is supposed to mean, she was already a Captain at time... and, so what?
she was no fighter or strong enough.
Strength has absolutely nothing to do with joining the Royal Guard.
 

Commander Shunsui

Well-Known Member
Interestingly he said: in the past 1000 years. Some of old dudes from the poster were born like 5000-6000 years ago (as they are older than even Yama).
Yeah but we already know Yamamoto is the one who kept them specifically in check. So there may be more we don't know about or it could mean somebody was born that is present now that is stronger than him.
 

Sablés

Well-Known Member
It's not that surprising, but I appreciate the implications of your words.

None of the theories here grab me, that could change in an instant. :mlpshrug
smh

Spoiler:



This doesn't imply that she was a captain during that point, rather the opposite. Mayuri insinuates that Shutara still doesn't have any respect for him, suggesting that he was in a position where she ought to have shown deference in the past. If Mayuri was a subordinate, she would never had a reason to respect him to begin with. After Urahara bit it, the research division belonged to Mayuri, therefore Shutara could have simply visited then. It's also perfectly sensible because the 12th RD was new, revolutionary, and created by Urahara. Someone who has vague ties to the RR and Kirinji. You can speculate that Shutara was sent down as an investigator and knew about Mayuri there.

We know the RR and Seireitei aren't completely isolated from each other. Shunsui and Ukitake have been to the palace, after all.
 

GilDLax

Well-Known Member
Strength is not a criteria by which one joins the RG. Only those who have revolutionized SS are invited to join.

In theory, even Hanataro or Kurumadani could someday join the RG if by some divine chance they manage to invent an awe inspiring thing.

The insane power up comes after joining the RG.
Strength has absolutely nothing to do with joining the Royal Guard.

Which doesn't mean strength isn't a secondary requirements or the promotion couldn't be delayed in light of it.

There have to be more than 5 revolutionary inventions through out SS's history and here we only have 5 members. What about who invented zanjutsu? Kidou? Hohou? Other traditions and customs of SS? etc.

4 of them were strong even before joining.
-Hikifune was a captain
-Nimaiya invented Zanpakutou, which directly is related to strength
-Ichibei was seasoned fighter all the way back million of years with the 4 Noble Families' ancestors.
-Even Kirinji has disgustingly high-level footwork (and from his words, it's shown the one he blitzes Soi Fon with has always been his level, not some power-up) despite being ''doctor''.

Could be coincidence or could be a hint.

The Zero Squad doesn't arbitrarily wait, they act immediately when necessary. Promotions would be no different, unless you had proof to the contrary.
Yet you based this on one order they have to act on immediately and a possibly once-or-twice-in-SS-history circumstance, which is grave damage after a Quincy invasion.

So instead of providing evidence of promotion being no different, you shifted the burden of proof on me? I'm not even saying promotion has to be different. You're the one assuming it isn't, and so I raise those possibilities where ''what if it is'' and all you can do is to kick the ball back in my court?

Ukitake even said there was no need to be so hasty with the promotion. And Hikifune was a captain at the time so there was no problem with her strength.


I'm not even sure what this is supposed to mean, she was already a Captain at time... and, so what?
Reread my original post where I conjected several scenarios why the timeline and Shutara's being captain 1900 years after her invention could still make sense! You really didn't bother to read the post you quoted? Because she was a captain at the time, that could be why her promotion was so quick.
 

Jugo13

Well-Known Member
I remember it was answered in the Klub House Q&A that the shihakusho wasn't chosen to be the uniform of the Shinigami until the Gotei 13 creation. It's likely that Senjumaru's promotion to RG position occurred sometime after the finalization of the uniform, even though characters like Yamamoto and Chojiro are seen wearing it 2,200 years ago.
 

Sablés

Well-Known Member
Baseless and confusing take, they literally gain strength just from training in the Royal Realm. If they needed a member to become strong, taking them to the Soul King Palace is the most direct route.
Not to mention that some RG are promoted captains, so they'd have a decent amount of strength regardless.
Hikifune's strength lies in her weight. She was skinny when Shinji knew her 100 years ago. This means she's compiled plenty of reiatsu over the years.
 

Mar55

The Darkness Rises
Hikifune's strength lies in her weight. She was skinny when Shinji knew her 100 years ago. This means she's compiled plenty of reiatsu over the years.
Yup, something she explained directly when talking to Ichigo and Renji.
 

Jugo13

Well-Known Member
Interestingly he said: in the past 1000 years. Some of old dudes from the poster were born like 5000-6000 years ago (as they are older than even Yama).
He said that in the context of why he remained as Captain-Commander for so long. The reason being no Shinigami has emerged strong enough to take his place during the 1,000 years he's been Captain Commander, which includes the first generation captains. It's been established that any captain can be stripped of their post in a sanctioned duel, not just the 11th division. I imagine the first generation captains consisted of blood knights, and would not condone a leader weaker than them.
 

TrueTrueTrue

Well-Known Member
There are many possible reasons for Shutara not to be promoted immediately. There are also many reasons for her to have been immediately promoted but still have made contact with Mayuri for some reason. We don't know when they met, we don't know when Shutara was leading research, and we don't know the circumstances, but you could literally insert just about any made up narrative reason to bring those two characters together in the massive amount of time at least one of them (Shutara) has been alive. This isn't a fuck up on Kubo's part, its us not knowing the full story or having the complete picture but pretending we do for some reason, which is silly.
 

lol 4th dimension reiatsu

Well-Known Member
Easiest coherent answer is that the thing she made already existed before but was only officialized as a uniform 1000 years ago where she is promoted and for some reason or another she met Mayuri and the RD later, maybe to check up on what Urahara left there.
 

Kor

Well-Known Member
What if that Eyepatch Riruka copy is actually a past life of Riruka?

Souls are suppose to reincarnate, right? :pepethink
 
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