Kakashi & Zabuza vs Kisame

who wins?

  • Kakashi & Zabuza

    Votes: 20 62.5%

  • Kisame

    Votes: 12 37.5%
  • Total voters
    32
With adequate teamwork, Kakashi and Zabuza can win. Now, I'm expecting the Kisame-tards to come in and argue how he is Bijuu level and above people like Pein.
 
Best strategy for Kakashi and Zabuza is kirigakure followed with doton: tsuiga and raikiri, which is an effective strategy against most opponents. Problem is: Kisame is also one of the Kiri no Shinobi Gatana Nana Ninshū, and him being unable to deal with a D-rank jutsu from the Mist is hard to believe. Worse, his reflexes and combat skills leave me doubtful that doton: tsuiga is sufficient to even cause him pause – he would probably have the physical power and skill to throw the ninja dogs off him and slash them to pieces in a spin of his Samehada.

Kisame's suiton jutsu seems, to me, to be powerful enough to overpower both Kakashi's and Zabuza's simultaneously. In close range, his combat skills also seem good enough to handle both Kakashi and Zabuza at once. He falls behind both in tactics and stealth, but as I said above I'm not sure what Kakashi and Zabuza can really achieve with that.

I think most of the scenarios where Kakashi and Zabuza come out with a victory involve Kakashi's Mangekyō Sharingan, but successfully employing that would be very hard.
 
I think Zabuza and Kakashi could pull it off together. Kakashi alone could cause Kisame some damage which was even stated by Itachi and that was before Kakashi had MS.
 
Building on Esponers post; Mist, and just hiding in it, while charging the damn thing, off dispersing the mist, and getting some clear shots off.

Sounds plausible to me :zaru
 
Kirigakure as a decoy to charge Mangekyō Sharingan, then shooting it once the mist has cleared? Might work, but it depends if Kisame has some way to clear the mist himself (which in turn depends if you're restricted everyone to just what they've shown).
 
I doubt Kisame would be able to clear the mist, as both him and Kakashi are skilled in Suiton, and Kakashi had no way of doing it. I'm not going on Solely what we know, but Kisame seems to me much more of a "powerhouse," spamming the enemy with large suitons, than someone who would know a jutsu to disperse a measly mist.
 
Kisame knows Mizu bunshin and has bijuu level chakra reserves.

He could easily make 500 mizu bunshins to confuse the enemy, then trap them in water bubbles/shark them/punch them with tsunade level strength/drown them in tsunami/slice them up with Samehada
 
PisOgPapir, I have difficulty seeing Kisame too terribly inconvenienced by kirigakure. My reasoning is that kirigakure was described in the Databook (I believe) as being a "typical" Mist jutsu, and was written as being D-rank. Kisame and Kakashi may both be suiton users, but Kakashi at least was not a Mist shinobi.

Shodai, Kisame creating five hundred mizu bunshin is either a terrible exaggeration, or an unconvincing extrapolation of his abilities. His chakra capacity and reserves/potential are definitely very high, but it remains to be seen if he's the type who can, or would, create five hundred mizu bunshin. Not to mention that it seems a rather poor strategy: a pair of suiton: daibakufu from Kakashi and Zabuza would overpower the mizu bunshin.

I would also not compare Kisame's physical power (slowly overpowering Asuma with the end of his Samehada) with Tsunade's (destroying anything her fists touch and creating craters with her kicks).
 
You guys don't seem to account that the D-Rank Mist would put Kakashi and ZAbuza at risk too. How the hell will they see an incoming flood?


The moment the fight starts, Zabuza Mists the field. Kisame uses his Flood no jutsu that he used against Team Gai.

How will Zabuza and Kakashi dodge it if they can't see it because of their own strategy?


Also, Kisame was able to punch Gai to the bottom of a lake. Gai punches through walls and he himself said 'superhuman strength!'. One punch from Kisame would likely wind either of his opponents if not defeat them.

His taijutsu skills are comparable to Gai because he has focused all his life on fighting close-range with Samehada. If he manages to close the distance, both opponents are dead meat.

Kisame is a berserker in close-range. His speed is comparable to Gai too, who is faster than Kakashi.

Also, there is nothing to stop Kisame from removing the Mist with his own counter.

EDIT: One final thing, there is no possibility of Zabuza delaying Kisame to buy time for Kakashi to charge his MS. Kisame is several levels higher than Zabuza and would make short work of him while Kakashi stays back. That strategy would be an utter no-no for the team.
 
If Kisame casts suiton: bakusui shōha, he presumably creates sufficient noise that Zabuza and Kakashi could respond – and the jutsu itself is not a harmful one, but rather an environment-changing technique which sets up later suiton jutsu. Your last sentence is the one I consider most salient (though what you say about Kisame's close-range fighting skill is also true). Kisame, as one of the Mist's best, probably already has some way to not be disadvantaged by a genin-level Mist jutsu. With it being the level it is, that Kisame does not himself rely on it says to me that he does not consider it quite as amazing as we might.
 
I don't see Mist being a factor at all in this match. It is D Rank, one of the basics taught to Mist shinobi probably and Zabuza would know that Kisame would simply dispel it.

I see it going like this:

Kisame floods the field, dispels Mist if it is active, and from there he closes the distance forcing Kakashi to concentrate blocking Kisame instead of focusing on charging his MS.
 
Eeeeewww three of my favorite people :D:

I think, together, Zabuza and Kakashi can take this. Kisame may know about Zabuza's techniques from having worked with him, but considering the fact that Zabuza knew of Kakashi's abilities prior to their fight thanks to the bingo book AND STILL LOST (TWICE!), little tidbits of information like that aren't going to help Kisame here.

Kirigakure no jutsu and things are out. o8
 
There's a bit of a difference there: Zabuza knew what he had read of Kakashi, but that does not mean he was strong against Kakashi's style or had had any chance or reason to practice fighting against it. Kisame's knowledge of Zabuza's jutsu will be better than Zabuza's or Kakashi, but that's not the main point. Zabuza's style was all about very effective use of basic, fundamental jutsu from Kirigakure no Satō.

Kisame is not just aware of what jutsu Zabuza uses, and he's not even just "familiar" with them – he knows half of them himself, and growing up in Kirigakure no Satō he's probably fought against users of them before. He's probably slaughtered a user of kirigakure no jutsu in a chūnin preliminary.

An interesting question is: why was Kakashi not a little more familiar with these jutsu, particularly suirō? He's an experienced, elite jōnin who has been on 1,116 missions (Databook). It does not seem realistic that he would not know about the chunin rank jutsu suirō or the genin rank jutsu kirigakure – one trip to the Wave Country would surely be sufficient, and one trip to the Wave Country in 1,116 missions does not seem unrealistic.

I think that perhaps Zabuza suffered an unusual and ill thought-out problem in the writing of the Databook: Kishimoto wrote out his jutsu as being very low rank, perhaps to contrast them with raikiri or maybe for some other reason. He decided that suirō and kirigakure would be "basic" jutsu after the fact, not realising how foolish that made Kakashi look. Had suirō been B-rank and kirigakure A, we'd probably not look down on Kakashi for getting caught by one and not being able to counter the other, and wouldn't expect Kisame to find it so easy to counter kirigakure.
 
I can't believe people actually pick Kisame....Kakashi and Zabuza with ease (assuming there teamwork is good)... I haven't seen any kind of good argument for Kisame...not too mention the fact Kakashi may be able to kill Kisame by himself...Zabuza makes this an easy win.
 
Mist wouldnt really help if Kisame uses his tsunami. I doubt Zabuza could hear him under water where Kisame could most likely see just fine.
 
this one for sure can go either way... kakashi and zabuza make an awsome team. i guess if they work together they can pull it off.
 
wow Kisame is so overrated in my opinion. He spams siutons all day...thats all, you are telling me that ninjas like Kakashi and Zabuza couldnt figure something out to negate the fact that he ONLY uses suitons? Ninjas can walk on water son, and kakashi doesnt get caught in the same jutsu twice...so water prison is out of the question

Plussssss, we are basing Kisame's superiority because of his 30% fight against Gai. Gai uses 0 tactic, nor does he use ninjutsu or genjutsu. I doubt Kakashi and Zabuza would fight Kisame head on like idiots

Are we all forgetting that Kakashi has mangekyou sharingan.....and that Kisame cant fly. Bijuu level chakra wont save you when ur head gets sent into another dimension


Gimme a break man, Kakashi can solo this

edit: Zabuza Sword Cannot be beat
 
Last edited:
Serenity said:
Best strategy for Kakashi and Zabuza is kirigakure followed with doton: tsuiga and raikiri, which is an effective strategy against most opponents. Problem is: Kisame is also one of the Kiri no Shinobi Gatana Nana Ninshū, and him being unable to deal with a D-rank jutsu from the Mist is hard to believe. Worse, his reflexes and combat skills leave me doubtful that doton: tsuiga is sufficient to even cause him pause ? he would probably have the physical power and skill to throw the ninja dogs off him and slash them to pieces in a spin of his Samehada.

Kisame's suiton jutsu seems, to me, to be powerful enough to overpower both Kakashi's and Zabuza's simultaneously. In close range, his combat skills also seem good enough to handle both Kakashi and Zabuza at once. He falls behind both in tactics and stealth, but as I said above I'm not sure what Kakashi and Zabuza can really achieve with that.

I think most of the scenarios where Kakashi and Zabuza come out with a victory involve Kakashi's Mangekyō Sharingan, but successfully employing that would be very hard.
Click to expand...

What Serenity said :nod.
 
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