In what sense is Kirin strong?

C

Chidori-Raikiri

Member
I don't get what's impressive about Sasuke's jutsu: Kirin.
How can Sasuke call that his trump card? or "Final Jutsu" to kill Itachi?

Take a look at Kirin.
Sasuke uses his chakra to make the lightning take the shape of Kirin and then zap Itachi.

Now, take a look at Suiryudan.
Kakashi uses his chakra to make the water take the shape of a Dragon and sends it after his opponent.

Want more? Sarutobi's Doton Dragon. Same deal, using your chakra to manipulate(not create) an already existing element.

What Sasuke just did is the same thing as what Kakashi/Sarutobi did, only for his own element, Lightning. Unless you argue that Lightning element is stronger than any other, Kirin strength = Suiryudan strength. It shouldn't be difficult for Kakashi to copy down Kirin just as he copied Zabuza's Suiryudan.

Thus Sasuke < Kakashi because Kakashi has MS and so many other jutsus that Sasuke doesn't have. Sasuke can only use Katon and Raiton while Kakashi can use Doton, Katon, Suiton, Raiton.

I will admit that Sasuke + Oro > Kakashi, but thats 2 on 1, so it doesn't count.
 
What makes Kirin strong is the fact that he summoned "Lightning" itself and not just manipulate its shape and also the amount of power is on a different scale than what people can normally produce with Nature manipulation.

Mainly already said by Zetsu here. Naruto didn't want Sasuke to die.
 
First, Anime is not canon. Kakashi doesn't know Katon.

Second, from we know, it seems Kirin can't be copied, b.c u need to know how to guide the lightning. Kirin's destructiveness far succeeds all the jutsus u mentioned.

Third, i think, I have made good thread about Kirin
 
:facepalm

1. Kirin has more destructive power than those techniques combined, and then multiple by 10.

2. Kirin moves at 1/1000 of a second. It CANNOT be dodged. Because of its ridiculous power, even if the opponent has a defense erected ahead of time, it (almost) CAN'T be blocked.

Did you NOT read the part where Zetsu said that it is beyond what is normally accomplishable due to the merits of elemental manipulation. That means if it clashes with ANY elemental (sans FRS and perhaps Amaterasu), it wins. It moves too fast to react to. And it has an insane AoE.

If you can't understand that, then maybe this isn't the best manga for you to be reading. There are topics MUCH more complex than Kirin's effectiveness.
 
Genius-24 said:
First, Anime is not canon. Kakashi doesn't know Katon.

Second, from we know, it seems Kirin can't be copied, b.c u need to know how to guide the lightning. Kirin's destructiveness far succeeds all the jutsus u mentioned.

Third, i think, I have made good thread about Kirin
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I think it could be copied. But i agree it is a strong jutsu and the destructiveness is probably pretty serious.
 
kirin is clearly way more powerful than that water jutsu kakashi used agaisnt itachi... there is no compairson to be made lol
 
Im not a Sasuke lover, you could slightly compare this with Nidaime who could summon water from nowhere and start some big jutsus.....



Except there is no chakra involved for Kirin.




Though what annoys me in the story is that he can use it only once...so there is something involved with the atmosphere that make it too risky to use again.


Kishi really gave power th this little guy...Gonna be fun to watch how naruto will beat him...
 
cyphon25 said:
I think it could be copied. But i agree it is a strong jutsu and the destructiveness is probably pretty serious.
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I seriously doubt that b.c it's not like a move where chakra is needed while performing. Kirin is just guiding pre-made lightning. You have to know how to guide something which doesn't require chakra. Probably person who created such lightning can only guide it due to that person forming dark clouds.
 
Noble Avenger said:
:facepalm

1. Kirin has more destructive power than those techniques combined, and then multiple by 10.

2. Kirin moves at 1/1000 of a second. It CANNOT be dodged. Because of its ridiculous power, even if the opponent has a defense erected ahead of time, it (almost) CAN'T be blocked.

Did you NOT read the part where Zetsu said that it is beyond what is normally accomplishable due to the merits of elemental manipulation. That means if it clashes with ANY elemental (sans FRS and perhaps Amaterasu), it wins. It moves too fast to react to. And it has an insane AoE.

If you can't understand that, then maybe this isn't the best manga for you to be reading. There are topics MUCH more complex than Kirin's effectiveness.
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First off, everything moves at 1/1000 of a second. You're challenging another person's ability to understand things and you can't even phrase what you are trying to say correctly.

300m/s that's the speed his jutsu moves at. To be honest, we don't know how fast electric chakra manipulation moves. so the speed might as well be worthless.

Second off, if you know anything about this series you know, it has no absolutes. Third, characters aren't always right.


Can't be blocked? hardly son. using the same methods sasuke used to create the lightning, you can divert it, by causing conditions that would force its path to the shortest route to the ground, ie missing you. Let alone the fact that anyone that can manipulate earth can simply surround themselves in sand. The brooding clouds have a tendency to give away whats about to happen.

Oh, and you say blah blah, unblockable undodgeable. Itachi obviously pulled it off, so others must be able to as well.

Good day.
 
Genius-24 said:
I seriously doubt that b.c it's not like a move where chakra is needed while performing. Kirin is just guiding pre-made lightning. You have to know how to guide something which doesn't require chakra. Probably person who created such lightning can only guide it due to that person forming dark clouds.
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Well then shouldn't Kakashi be able to do it without even copying it... he just breathes fire like Sasuke to create the clouds, and then he would create the lightning guide in his hand... i am sure he would be smart enough to figure it out.
 
cyphon25 said:
Well then shouldn't Kakashi be able to do it without even copying it... he just breathes fire like Sasuke to create the clouds, and then he would create the lightning guide in his hand... i am sure he would be smart enough to figure it out.
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and...It's been like 30 years and he hasn't showed anything except Raikiri?
I am not too fond of that assumption.
-It's like saying, b.c Shikamaru is really smart, by looking at rasengan once, he can figure out how to do it.

and, u said Kakashi breaths fire? lol what is that?
 
Come back when another human shows the power to bust mountains. Then and only then will you be looked at as something more than a tard.
 
Kirin sucks...


are you happy now OP? :zaru




Actually its a fine jutsu...If you actually READ the manga you wouldn't make this thread. But FRS is still better :noworry
 
Shinkirou said:
Come back when another human shows the power to bust mountains. Then and only then will you be looked at as something more than a tard.
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umm Tsunade anyone have you ever played Ultimate Ninja i mean she does it all the time oh an Gai Lee Neji alot of ppl:amuse
 
Kirin is a weak piece of crap

The only reason the one Sasuke used was strong was because he had Ametarasu heating up as well. Nothing Sasuke could do with normal katons can come even close to the Amaterasu, He was just lucky that Amaterasu was a 'fire technique'
 
Genius-24 said:
and...It's been like 30 years and he hasn't showed anything except Raikiri?
I am not too fond of that assumption.
-It's like saying, b.c Shikamaru is really smart, by looking at rasengan once, he can figure out how to do it.

and, u said Kakashi breaths fire? lol what is that?
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I am sure he has copied Sasuke's Fire attacks. Maybe he never tried to create an attack that strong b/c it isn't necessary and it isn't convenient at all. It takes work and chakra to set up (if there isn't already thunder clouds in the sky). I get what you are saying but i guarantee Kakashi could learn the technique.. whether by sharingan copy or his intelligence.... Your Shika comparison doesn't really work b/c he isn't "ninja" smart, he is just intelligent. Kakashi is a naturally intelligent shinobi
 
cyphon25 said:
I am sure he has copied Sasuke's Fire attacks. Maybe he never tried to create an attack that strong b/c it isn't necessary and it isn't convenient at all. It takes work and chakra to set up (if there isn't already thunder clouds in the sky). I get what you are saying but i guarantee Kakashi could learn the technique.. whether by sharingan copy or his intelligence.... Your Shika comparison doesn't really work b/c he isn't "ninja" smart, he is just intelligent. Kakashi is a naturally intelligent shinobi
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He isn't ninja smart? Even Kakashi was vastly impressed by what Shika did. Shika is the best leader of a group. He forms best strategies involving shinobies and himself.

Shika is the best tactician in Naruto by significant margin. Kakashi has yet to show something impressive on Shika's level consistently.
 
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Genius-24 said:
He isn't ninja smart? Even Kakashi was vastly impressed by what Shika did. Shika is the best leader of a group. He forms best strategies involving shinobies and himself.

Shika is the best tactician after Sasuke. Kakashi has yet to show something impressive on Shika's level consistently.
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By Ninja smart i mean Kakashi created a technique and was a jounin at a young age... there is a difference. I admit Shikamaru is a better tactician than Kakashi and he is ahead of Sasuke to... there is no way he is behind Sasuke (to much fan love i would say, i can't call you out on this much, but here i have to). I meant as far as learning techniques and actual ninja skill Kakashi far surpasses Shikamaru... that is what i was trying to get at when comparing their intelligence.
 
Genius-24 said:
He isn't ninja smart? Even Kakashi was vastly impressed by what Shika did. Shika is the best leader of a group. He forms best strategies involving shinobies and himself.

Shika is the best tactician after Sasuke. Kakashi has yet to show something impressive on Shika's level consistently.
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WHOA HOLD UP! You say Shika is after Sasuke on being a tactician? Ok wow Shika has shown several times his ability with his mind lets not bring IQ into this but Sasuke is a better fighter but if he was going against Shika he would have some trouble. I dont want to say he isnt good himself i mean he did great against Dei but do you think he can lead a squad like what Shika did?
 
YEah agreed


ITS NOT BECAUSE WE SPEAK MORE OF ONE OR TWO CHARACTERS THAT IT MEANS THEY ARE STRONGER THAN EVERYBODY DAMMIT!!!!!!!!!


Hehem...*cough*..sorry for this one.

No but really people whats all this comparing nonsense? IT all just becomes speculation.

Just like this manga proved us long ago...each ninja can reach a peak in his talent, surpass himself and beat anyone and anywhere, anytime.


Stop trying to put characters above others, cause that leads the manga nowhere..

And to that guy dissing Kakashi...

ummm I think, that fits in perfectly. We haven't seen as much as we will see in the future for this character. And the week after that happens people will be comparing Kakashi to the other Hokages....-_-



EDIT: OH and to the thread owner..

Kirin is strong in the sense that Sasuke can pull it out when he has no chakra left, and in the sense where he can aim to kill the one hes trying to kill for years. There you go.
 
cyphon25 said:
By Ninja smart i mean Kakashi created a technique and was a jounin at a young age... there is a difference. I admit Shikamaru is a better tactician than Kakashi and he is ahead of Sasuke to... there is no way he is behind Sasuke (to much fan love i would say, i can't call you out on this much, but here i have to). I meant as far as learning techniques and actual ninja skill Kakashi far surpasses Shikamaru... that is what i was trying to get at when comparing their intelligence.
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lol sry i meant, Shika is best tactician b4 Sasuke. lol. I agree Shika is on different level.
 
Shunsuke kiba said:
WHOA HOLD UP! You say Shika is after Sasuke on being a tactician? Ok wow Shika has shown several times his ability with his mind lets not bring IQ into this but Sasuke is a better fighter but if he was going against Shika he would have some trouble. I dont want to say he isnt good himself i mean he did great against Dei but do you think he can lead a squad like what Shika did?
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lol dude sry man, it's late and i screwed up. easy now. alright.
 
cyphon25 said:
So do you get what i was saying about the difference in intelligence b/t the 2 of them?
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i see ur point but u gotta understand how only thing Kakashi created was Raikiri, excluding MS. Shika is laziest human being. lol no joke. we have seen how with enough motivation he can make ninja far above his level look foolish.

but, all this still doesn't bring us anywhere regarding Kakashi and Kirin. May be after seeing it once, with considerable prep time, he can pull something closer to Kirin, but he still isn't Katon user. Kakashi can't copy such things(gouryuka) in battle, b.c he doesn't know to how to reproduce that elemental chakra. He can probably do other elemental techniques on basic levels, hence only doton he knows is going underground. and, Gouryukka is strong Katon.
 
LOL... I remember someone wrote about Sasuke's Kirin Ultimate skill has so Uber Chunnin Level Charge Time. ROFL
 
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